Question Number: 19442

Law 12 - Fouls and Misconduct 6/18/2008

RE: Amateur Adult

warren of Sydney, NSW Australia asks...

This question is a follow up to question 19308

Hi Panel,

Thanks for all your answers.

Can I please confirm what would be the right ruling in another slight variation on the situation of the violent conduct before the ball was kicked and moved.

If the violent conduct had happened just before the Kickoff to restart the *2nd* half, wouldn't that mean that the player involved was by that stage a player even if he had been a substitute at the end of the first half (by virtue of the substituion being completed when he enters the field of play (assuming all other requirements of Law 3 have been met)), and therefore his status at the end of the first half (player or substitute) irrelevant ?

I am assuming that the answers about the status of the player at the end of the first half refer to when an incident occurred during half-time but before the players have retaken the field for the 2nd half, as I would have considered that once they have taken the field for the start of the 2nd half I have 11 *players* on each team (as explained above).

Have I got that right ?

Finally, given the fact that a game can be protested in some situations if a referee misapplies the laws, what would be the mechanics of selling the non-substitution of the player as mentioend by Ref Fleischer ? Do you mean that you would simply fail to inform them that they could technically use one of their subs because the match had not yet started, or would you declare that you saw that the offending player had kicked the ball ever so slightly on his way to strike the opponent ? ;-)

Cheers,

Warren.

Answer provided by Referee Richard Dawson

It could depend on the rules of the competition . YES if it his was a world cup with limited substitution the players on the field at the end of the half up to the start of the second half are the players of record and any VC that gets one sent off reduces the team by a player. However, with unlimited substitution situations this could prove problematic in determining if the player actually on the field who does the VC was in fact a player at the end of the half. It is interesting to note that a referee while sending off the player for VC at the start of the match is not actually required by law to inform a team they could replace him although I could not fault him for doing so either.
Cheers

Answer provided by Referee Gary Voshol

Warren, you are correct in your second half thinking. In a limited substitution game, the subbing procedure is formally noted before the 2nd half kickoff. With unlimited subs, the ref assumes that those who are lined up on the field are players, including the one in the funny jersey who is the goalkeeper. So if one of them gets sent off between the call to take the field and the kickoff, the team will play short.

Notice my comment about the keeper? The ref seeing the correct number of players and one of them dressed specially will make the logical assumption that the different one is the keeper. Even if this is not the same keeper as in the last half. Sure, the Laws say that the referee must be "informed" before a keeper switch, and I've got a couple of old-war-horse coaches around who still tell me they've made a switch - probably because they've been burned by a "gotcha" ref in the past. But the observant referee will immediately conclude that the new player with the spiderman shirt is the new goalkeeper, and his presence on the field with that shirt is notice enough in unlimited sub games. The same applies during the game when the team calls for subs. The referee sees a new kid in a keeper jersey going out onto the field, and the old keeper coming off. He thinks, "I guess they're changing keepers." Wow, he figured it out all by himself without being reminded by the coach.

Answer provided by Referee Chuck Fleischer

Warren what you must remember is the match has started in the scenario mentioned and those on the park just prior fo your blowing for the restart of play are players. Previously the match had not started.

Ref Voshol writes about what the US Soccer Federation has had to write as a policy because so many referees here simply do not understand how to substitute a player during either period of play, let alone before the start of a subsequent period. Whilst you and I know the substitute would report to an official and wait at the touchline to be admitted to the field referees in America just aren't that sophisticated.

Mechanics of selling no replacement for the player in #19308 would be not informing the team's manager of his ignorance and the referee keeping his mouth shut. Again this would be a direct result of a lack of sophistication about The Game. Here the referee doesn't misapply the Law, he just doesn't call attention to a lack of knowledge on the manager's part.

In an unlimited substitution match figuring out whether or not a specific individual was or was not a player at the end of the first period of play is a difficult task especially if he is to be disciplined. Once he intermingles with the other players and substitutes he becomes part of the forest and not just a lone tree. There are clues, a substitute is clean and dry, a player is sweaty and dirty [sometimes]. The captain might be called upon for assistance but his honesty might be suspect if he knew what was coming next.

Regards,