Question Number: 29225

Law 11 - Offside 3/5/2015

RE: Select Under 18

Gary Morgan of Culpeper, Virginia USA asks...

Thank you for your excellent forum.

Regarding a deliberate play by a defender 'resetting' the offside equation....

I think I would feel better with an explanation of the nuances between 'deflection' and 'deliberate.' As an example: An attacker makes a forward pass to a teammate in an offside position. A defender makes a very deliberate attempt to intercept the pass, but the ball rolls over his foot and continues to the PIOP. The defender in no way controls the ball.

I would say this falls under the same category of a deflection (or a GK's deliberate save) and therefore the flag goes up as soon as the PIOP plays the ball. A few ref-mates of mine disagree, indicating that the deliberate nature of the defender's actions means the offside equation is 'reset' with the defender's touch. (Similar to the 'You Call It' question where the defender deliberately handles the ball on a cross in front of the goal, directing it to a PIOP who subsequently scores).

May I have your opinions please?
Thank you!

Answer provided by Referee Joe McHugh

Hi Gary
This is left to the referee and assistant to determine the decision based on their opinion as to what happened. What can be described as a deliberate play may in fact be a deflection and vice versa.
I suppose I am slightly old school in that when I look at the contact I determine if the player actually influenced the ball with a deliberate play.
Have a look at this video
http://garcia-aranda.com/offsideifab/eng004video008.html
It is clear that the defender deliberately played the ball albeit to a player in an offside position so there is no offside
Now here is one that is more of a challenge to call
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6njsWk1Z-4&index=20&list=UU_Ba5iDNpuPJqxH17NPbBCA
Is the ball deflected off the defenders head or was it a deliberate play?
I would be agreeing with the AR who flagged it although the Pro Referee body is suggesting that it was a deliberate play.
Now this is where opinions come in. When I look at this I don't see a direction change in the ball. There is an elevation change which has to be considered. I see it as the ball deflecting off the top of the defenders head.
Here is an absolutely correct decision by the CR and overrules the AR
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beFY-IF6ahQ
The Blue player clearly plays the ball to the White player in an offside position. No offside here
Now the CR and AR has to be on the same page here. There is nothing worse than an AR sticking up a flag for gaining an advantage and the CR seeing it as a reset. That will always cause a furore when it is not seen as an AR error such as in the video which can and should be avoided.

Answer provided by Referee Dennis Wickham

Control is no longer the standard. One can make a deliberate, though poor, play of the ball without ever demonstrating control of the ball. IMO, the issue is one of time and space. If the opponent had time to make a deliberate play of the ball, a challenge for the ball should be considered deliberate.

Perhaps the only part of the decision that is now simple is this: when in doubt, keep the flag down.

Answer provided by Referee Richard Dawson

Hi Gary,
thanks for the kind words.
There is little doubt that offside interpretation is an instigator of discussion around the leagues of the world no matter what level of play. Although some of offside is fairly straight forward, it is ironic how one interprets a meaning of a word that will deny one team a goal and allows a goal in the other for the exact same thing! Each referee will have an opinion based on his or her current understanding and knowledge of the LOTG.

If you think back on the deliberate handling scenario where an offside striker receives what we can call a gift from a defender by the reset of his restriction. You can think that the redirection of that ball was NOT controlled but WAS deliberate . If it was not deliberate, there could NOT be a foul of deliberate handling. It would have served the defenders purpose to have actually caught and controlled the ball with his hands rather than stick it out there to knock the ball away!

I have adopted a position when trying to explain recent offside interpretation by comparing the THOUGHT process of equating deliberate handling with a deflection by a defender. The BALL hits the player not the player hits the ball! The ball is an object propelled at different speeds, from close or far range, with awareness of the ball flight and repositioning to play it or no idea the ball is about to strike the player out of his view. In the middle of a group of opponents there might be no space to maneuver properly.

I pound the ball at goal with a defender three feet in front of me wedged in-between two opponents as hard as I can that defender might not even have time to react to get out of the way never mind find time to play the ball deliberately. That ball striking him is likely going to be deflected with a instinctive quiver of movement that no one should mistake for a deliberate play.

What I find difficult to convey to those that ask for help in interpreting offside is we do NOT reward MISTAKES. A MISKICK is NOT a deflection! Your situation 'Quote ' A defender makes a very deliberate attempt to intercept the pass, but the ball rolls over his foot and continues to the PIOP. The defender in no way controls the ball. end quote

Your thinking is because he failed to kick that ball clear or redirect it elsewhere or not stop and control it that it is a deflection rather than a deliberate play gone awry?

Did the offside player or any offside player challenge him for possession? NO!
Was the ball available to be fairly challenged in that the defender had time and space in which to operate? YES!
Was the defender aware of the ball? YES!
Did the defender deliberately move over and attempt to play that ball? YES!
Did that defender TOUCH the ball? YES!
Then offside is reset because the ball is no longer last touched by a team mate and it was deliberately but poorly played by an opponent. I know you are thinking he only tried to play the ball to intercept it to keep it getting through to the offside player.

Are you thinking he did what he did because he was affected by the offside player! Thus the offside player is affecting the play. The thing is we do NOT consider what defenders THINK, only what offside players DO! That offside player did nothing but be in an offside position which is NOT involvement because he did not impede or prevent the defender from challenging for the ball.

Now look at the same conditions but change the dynamics. The defender was taking a step to pursue the offside attacker when a bullet of a pass was pushed through towards his direction. There was no time to react or change his movement thus the ball simply skipped on past him grazing his foot. Offside criteria is not reset because the subsequent touch was NOT deliberately incurred.

A mistake is when there is time and space to react and as a player you are aware of the ball headed in your direction. I.E. you run over to clear a rolling ball and it skates off your foot to go where ever, it is on you, it was a deliberate action undertaken with ..You.. being in control and the loss of possession is your deliberate action. It resets offside for the opposition. Because they no longer last touched the ball you just did!

Whether or not you like it or agree FIFA and IFAB have indicated they prefer goals to unnecessary flags. I know historically inclined players will rail on you, when you allow a goal off a crap deliberate play. Be it a foot flick or a head flick but those two body parts are MORE likely to be used in a deliberate play than any other body part! It is difficult to change social convention when the old school thinking was a dubious offside goal was worse than an incorrect offside given stopping what should have been a good goal. The adage when in doubt do not wave it about still applies even if we grasp that a PLAYABLE body part on a static line defines if one is on or off, even before we look further for ANY involvement.

This video was most challenging to determine that play SHOULD have been ruled offside but WAS NOT correctly evaluated because it was NOT seen as a deflection when in fact it was! The defender's leg was coming back to ground . The ball is played by an onside attacker to the other onside attacker. However, the return pass which puts the other attacker in an offside restricted position is defected off the back of the defender's leg. The offside player plays that ball without penalty because it is not seen by the AR or CR and a goal results . I believe the defender was unaware his leg was going to be struck by the ball against his calf

https://vimeo.com/110117758 A clear deflection but not so clear!

There will always be discrepancies in how one referee might see a CLOSE decision what should not be unclear is the consistency that individual referee applies to EVERY decision he makes based on their view of the LOTG at that moment in their career . It is not that you MIGHT later change your mind . We had to work hard at convincing many that a deliberate handling that was not a save could in fact reset offside and a goal could be scored. see YOU call it #37 .

MLS video review 6 in a row can you tell?
http://www.proreferees.com/news-offside-videos.php

MLS 2 deflections Play of the Week 33: Offside calls in NE vs. TOR and CLB vs. PHI
note the 1st video the attempted header many might consider the ball only deflected but was interpreted as deliberately played
the 2nd video compare it to the FIFA one below
http://www.proreferees.com/news-play-of-the-week---2014---wk33.php

FIFA deflection
http://garcia-aranda.com/offsideifab/eng004video007.html

Cheers
PS read our offside explanation on the main page and look over the myriad of offside examples stored on the site.